It’s not a nice way to go. Much better to just croak suddenly, if you ask me.
This part of that short piece was particularly sad:
“Losing Dad … was truly awful for Mum, not least because her dementia meant she kept forgetting he was dead,” she wrote.
“I had to keep giving her the bad news over and over again.”
Seems odd this is being revealed now. I thought it had been common knowledge for quite a while.
Like the case with Reagan, I’m conflicted. I can’t help but think there’s a certain poetic justice in all of this and yet no one really deserves it.
I wonder if there’s been any research into a link between remorse and dementia? It might help the unrepentant Mulroney as he enters his Golden Age.
I have to admit that I am conflicted too. It’s sad on a personal level, though.
At the time, I loved Margaret Thatcher for her stance on the Falkland Islands. Those Argy Bargie bastards didn’t have a chance!
Thatcher Has Dementia
Well, she is conservative, no?
At the time, I loved Margaret Thatcher for her stance on the Falkland Islands.
You mean les îles Malouines, don’t you?
Las islas Malvenas pertenecen a la Argentina!
Your a scum bag old man…
Sorry.. I forgot to respect my elders. But sill there is nothing like watching some old fart from victoria think that he is actualy relevent.
Stick to Jockn’ the bloggingtories loser.
And yes I know I am suppose to be a neo-con god lovin person. But sorry just some 28 year old skateboarder from toronto who laughs at some old dude from Victoria who’s whole blog is dedicated to Jonckn the BT’s.
PS:Is this really how bad life gets when your the age you are?
I mean sitting on the internet all day whinning about others, man your life must suck. I hope this is not my future.
“poetic justice” “Well, she is conservative, no”
Do you people have no class? This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion? You show none just because they disagree with you?
HM says
“Do you people have no class? This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion?”
Um no these old farts got Dementia a long time ago.
I mean sitting on the internet all day whinning about others, man your life must suck. I hope this is not my future.
Sounds brighter than the present you’re living, you snarling arsehole.
Seeing as how the sanctimonious prigs have descended, I’m going to link to this.
Don’t worry. Thatcher’s too addled to understand it anyway.
Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do. Another little bit of irony to the Thatcher epic.
JDot — Would I be more relevant if I lived in Toronto? And had a skateboard?
He probably doesn’t even know of Thatcher’s support for the butcher Pinochet and for apartheid South Africa.
Good thing I didn’t go on about the wood-sprung dance floor to be installed directly above her resting place, together with souvenir stalls and fast-food outlets to service the people that will be queuing for miles for a chance to dance on her grave. 😉
Ti-Guy: Out of respect for ol’ Maggie, will you be changing your Gravatar? Maybe something more appropriate — Dame Edna, say…:)
It’s an homage.
Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do. Another little bit of irony to the Thatcher epic.
Quite like when she was in power….
.This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion?
Yes. Maybe we could ask dr roy to skull fuck her as some kind of honour after she is dead.
Okay, that’s just gross.
It’s sad and very hard to go through for families – my mother-in-law did of Alzheimers. In the end she was actually quite a happy person living in her own world….but for us it was hell. It wore my father-in-law down – he died before she did. We moved in for a year to help my father-in-law out and my husband (both working) took turns staying up at night to watch her. I got so run down I very sick twice.
It hard for families but people like Reagan and Thatcher would have their own nurses and maids, etc. to help out – the family can get their rest.
Red Says…
“JDot — Would I be more relevant if I lived in Toronto? And had a skateboard?”
Nothing….
More worried about the company you keep.
Bottom line. This post is low. You are a smart person and a good writter who can push buttons(You got me). This is just low, so I went low.
PS:To the BT stuff.
I find you waste your time. That’s all you seem to whine about.
Waste of talent in my mind.
That should be “NO”
Feel free to “flame me”…..
You need an edit button Red…
To Ty-guy.
My Man, I have read some of your stuff, but you are the reason my mom said do not to talk to strangers.
I was commenting on the owners blog. So just so you know this is the last time I wan’t to have contact with you.
You are wierd. Maybe I am to, but I don’t wan’t to interact with someone like. Sorry.
Thank-you
All the Best….
What a tragedy.
When I was 28, I had put myself through graduate school and had started a career. Years later, I’m being scolded by an illiterate, 28-year old skateboarder.
How times have changed.
F*ck….
Last time I swear..
Ty says…
“When I was 28, I had put myself through graduate school and had started a career. Years later, I’m being scolded by an illiterate, 28-year old skateboarder.”
Now imagine doing that on a skateboard? Jzzzz, you sound like big Bill O talking about Hip Hop.
thank god I grew up in the spell check generation.
Listen Ty, you have no doubt forgot more then I have learned….
But I could careless My life is great. “Livin’ the dream”(sorry for being young on that spelling lol) But all I can say is your wierd).
That’s all, now please leave me alone.
Thank-you
“Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do.”
If suffering around her indicates dementia, I would imagine her dememtia kicked in around 1979.
And that sodden alcoholic Kennedy has brain cancer. Your point being?
There you go.
RT,
Sad news indeed. Thatcher was a politician that changed a nation and changed perceptions around the world.
She truly was made of iron. All my sympathies to her family and friends.
Thatcher was a politician that changed a nation and changed perceptions around the world.
Absolutely. The perception of an imminent death causing much joy was somewhat unknown before Thatcher came along.
🙂 <— This means I’m funny…like Ann Coulter.
Things I DID NOT admire Lady Thatcher for:
* Her attempts to one-up Her Majesty The Queen;
* The over-liberalisation of the British Economy – she just took it way too far;
* Her recalcitrance on South Africa and Chile;
* Her disdain for The Commonwealth;
* Her contempt for the “Wets” (including HR Macmillan) and their legitimate concerns about her neo-liberal economic programme;
* Her small-minded and quite middle-class snobbishness that looked upon people like Bus-Riders with pity;
Things I DID admire Lady Thatcher for:
* Her firmness in dealing with the IRA and Sinn Fein;
* Her defence of The Falklands colony;
* Her opposition of Communism (while at the same time brokering a firm detente …);
* Her transfer of Public Housing units over to Private Ownership (thereby making tenants owners);
* Her (initial anyway) re-balancing of the economy in reducing the power of the Unions (again, this went too far in the end, and at times was too brutal – but in the end the Union’s death-grip on the British Economy had to be dialed-back).
Overall, it’s a mixed-record with a score somewhat to the positive side of of the ledger. She was influential however, and history will remember her as a rather important figure.
One thing I will not do, is make tasteless remarks about someone in the extreme twilight of their existence.
The rigid, programmatic, and quite unthinking partisanship of people will never cease to amaze (and disgust) me.
Lemmings – all.
One thing I will not do, is make tasteless remarks about someone in the extreme twilight of their existence.
I don’t know; providing a capsule commentary of Thatcher’s record pretty much does that.
🙂 <— This means I can say whatever I want and not be challenged.
Margaret Thatcher was one of Britain’s greatest Prime Ministers
You were in diapers at the time. How would you know?
This gushy over-exuberance is all Conservatives have, isn’t it?
Oh ya well, ted kennedy has cancer, haha?
This is very low of you red tory, very low.
I was 2 weeks old when she was forced out by her party…
How do I know? Well, I’ve read a lot about British history and politics – both left and right – and I came to the conclusion that Britain would have been strangeled by socialism – like France and Itlay – if she did not embark on her economic reforms Yes a lot of people lost jobs which is never a good thing, but those jobs were in the old, outdated nationalized industries in dire need of competion and modernization (they would have been thrown out of work eventually with globalization). But now Britain consistently has the lowest unemployment rates in Europe – where all the other socialist utopias are struggling with high unemployment rates – in good economic times- and bad economic times – how do I know? I read the Economist magazine 😉
Thatcher was on of Britain’s worse Prime Ministers.
As ATY points out, she did bring about the liberalization of many branches of industry. One being financial services. Now she herself ventures into “hedge funds” after her retirement. Some may recall that Tiger Management employed her on the board of directors.
Within months of her joining Tiger, the company lost billions and was forced to close shortly after – blaming an irrational market. Ironic given that the “irrational market” was created in part by Thatcher and the other “swinging dicks”…
Margaret Thatcher was positively Victorian in her attitude with regards to unions. She was a champion of laissez-faire conservatism that seemed on a crusade with all the religious overtones.
She shared many economic theories with Reagan. It’s surprising how many times Capitalism has to be rescued by government…. The U.S., once the biggest creditor nation became the largest debtor nation…
While she was dealing with IRA, she was also praising Abdul Haq (she has him flown to England). Abdul Haq as al Qaida leader who once said “We use poor rockets, we cannot control them. They sometimes miss, I don’t care if I kill 50 civilians”.
I can’t wait for her to expire….
Too bad Teddy Kennedy doesn’t have dementia.He gets to remember the drunken abuse, rape and acts of cowardice performed in his life right until the moment his brain outgrows his skull.
Somewhere a water logged young girl smiles.
🙂 <– look! i can use one too..i’m absolved!
Ah, that’s swell, dear.
Who let Kursk out of rehab?
Ben — Consider it a public service. Doesn’t your sanctimony and moral self-righteousness feel good?
By the way, tighties…gloating over Ted Kennedy’s imminent demise does not absolutely nothing for me. So have at it.
What bizrare ideas they have. Margaret Thatcher is to Canadian Conservatives as Ted Kennedy is to Canadian Liberals?
Huh? Whaa? Eh?
Ti-Guy
August 25, 2008 at 1:55 pm
He probably doesn’t even know of Thatcher’s support for the butcher Pinochet and for apartheid South Africa.
If support for apartheid in South Africa makes you worthy of death then I guess Gandhi got what he deserved?
All of you who would disrespect someone in this condition simply for having different political views is absolutly disgusting.
I think if you read the first comments you’ll see there wasn’t really that much “disrespect” as you put it. That only started when all the phony self-righteousness started to kick in.
What is it with these children and their relentless scolding of perfect strangers?
Go mouth of to your parents like you should, sweeties. After all, your present condition is their fault.
Stay classy RT.
You guys do great work.
From Tuco’s own blog:
DavidA wrote:
Let them have it…I reserve the right to laugh maliciously whenever a Trudeau gets smoked.
08/25/08 18:32:49
tuco wrote:
Fair enough.
08/25/08 19:00:48
Seriously, give it up. No one believes you righties can actually empathise or sympathise, much less with people you don’t even know personally. You’ve spent the last eight years ridiculing, defaming and vilifying everyone who doesn’t agree with you; laughing when Rush Limbaugh called the torture at Abu Ghraib “frat hazing” and chuckling when Ann Coulter accused 9/11 widows of “enjoying their husband’s deaths.”
You have no credibility on this issue. And no amount of self-righteous scolding is going to change that.
austin – “If support for apartheid in South Africa makes you worthy of death then I guess Gandhi got what he deserved?”
Not possible. Gandhi died prior to apartheid existing in Africa. Yes, prior to that non-whites in south africa were subject to several British laws which were racist. Gandhi opposed most, if all, of those laws.
That is not to say that Gandhi was not a racist – he did believe, at least when he was a young man that blacks were inferior to indians. However, there is a huge difference between supporting brutally racist policies in the 1980s and having racist views, while opposing racist policies, over a hundred years ago. Not surprisingly you can’t see the difference.
Furthermore, I have never seen any posts by RedTory et all praising Gandhi – nor do I think that most of us here would consider Gandi anything close to an ideal. He was a social conservative, religious nutter, opponent of science and reason, aweful father, hypocrit etc, etc, etc.
Actually while Gandhi was in South Africa from 1895-1915 a lot of his time was spent on getting Indians on the right side of the “colour bar”. If those action don’t make him a supporter of apratheid what does? So if most of you don’t consider Margret Thatcher or Gandhi ideal political figures, than who is?
austin – “Actually while Gandhi was in South Africa from 1895-1915 a lot of his time was spent on getting Indians on the right side of the “colour bar”. If those action don’t make him a supporter of apratheid what does?”
Gandhi spent much of his time in South Africa not trying to stop indians from losing rights. He also opposed the treatment of blacks and protested against British political acts and regulations against blacks such as The Native Land Act. Martin Luther King Jr concentrated on the oppression of blacks – that doesn’t mean that he was racist and supported oppression against hispanics.
“So if most of you don’t consider Margret Thatcher or Gandhi ideal political figures, than who is?”
Really? I have to consider either Thatcher or Gandhi the ideal? I reject both and would prefer to have neither as a leader of my country (although at least Gandhi had a tendency to recognize some of his flaws and had little interest in being the leader of his country). Both were uncompromising, had no doubt that they were right, and had almost no interest in what the other side had to say.
The other thing to mention is that is very possible that other oppressed populations in south africa didn’t actually want Gandhi’s help. Most of Gandhi’s early work against the British in south africa was a spectacular failure. Until shortly before Gandhi left SA he was considered to have done more damage than good for the indians living in SA, indeed, most indians there were not huge fans of his to say the least. Even as he was leaving he received most of his praise for standing up to the british, and for using non-violent resistance, but not for results, because he really didn’t actually intiate much, if any, positive change there.
Interesting…. Why is first comment awaiting moderation?
It is interesting to see all of the experts on Imperial South African History emerge …
sarcasm intended.
“It is interesting to see all of the experts on Imperial South African History emerge …
sarcasm intended.”
I don’t claim to be an expert on SA, or anything else for that matter. I have however, read through almost all of Gandhi’s 100 volume “collected writings” (along with several biographies which generally give a far more biased and less critical view of Gandhi than he did himself) in which he is very candid about his failures in SA and how after each of his campaigns completely fell apart there it took him years each time to regain the respect and position within the indian community to be able to launch another one. He wrote about almost every major political policy while he was there. As for apartheid not existing until after Gandhi’s death that doesn’t take an expert – any history book will tell you apartheid started in south africa after the election of the National Party in 1948.
Red Tory v.3.0.3 
Dr. Roy will be most upset I’m sure.
Reagan, Thatcher…..who’s next?
It’s not a nice way to go. Much better to just croak suddenly, if you ask me.
This part of that short piece was particularly sad:
Seems odd this is being revealed now. I thought it had been common knowledge for quite a while.
Like the case with Reagan, I’m conflicted. I can’t help but think there’s a certain poetic justice in all of this and yet no one really deserves it.
I wonder if there’s been any research into a link between remorse and dementia? It might help the unrepentant Mulroney as he enters his Golden Age.
I have to admit that I am conflicted too. It’s sad on a personal level, though.
At the time, I loved Margaret Thatcher for her stance on the Falkland Islands. Those Argy Bargie bastards didn’t have a chance!
Thatcher Has Dementia
Well, she is conservative, no?
At the time, I loved Margaret Thatcher for her stance on the Falkland Islands.
You mean les îles Malouines, don’t you?
Las islas Malvenas pertenecen a la Argentina!
Your a scum bag old man…
Sorry.. I forgot to respect my elders. But sill there is nothing like watching some old fart from victoria think that he is actualy relevent.
Stick to Jockn’ the bloggingtories loser.
And yes I know I am suppose to be a neo-con god lovin person. But sorry just some 28 year old skateboarder from toronto who laughs at some old dude from Victoria who’s whole blog is dedicated to Jonckn the BT’s.
PS:Is this really how bad life gets when your the age you are?
I mean sitting on the internet all day whinning about others, man your life must suck. I hope this is not my future.
“poetic justice” “Well, she is conservative, no”
Do you people have no class? This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion? You show none just because they disagree with you?
HM says
“Do you people have no class? This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion?”
Um no these old farts got Dementia a long time ago.
I mean sitting on the internet all day whinning about others, man your life must suck. I hope this is not my future.
Sounds brighter than the present you’re living, you snarling arsehole.
Seeing as how the sanctimonious prigs have descended, I’m going to link to this.
Don’t worry. Thatcher’s too addled to understand it anyway.
Oops…Link for snarling arseholehere.
Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do. Another little bit of irony to the Thatcher epic.
JDot — Would I be more relevant if I lived in Toronto? And had a skateboard?
He probably doesn’t even know of Thatcher’s support for the butcher Pinochet and for apartheid South Africa.
Good thing I didn’t go on about the wood-sprung dance floor to be installed directly above her resting place, together with souvenir stalls and fast-food outlets to service the people that will be queuing for miles for a chance to dance on her grave. 😉
Ti-Guy: Out of respect for ol’ Maggie, will you be changing your Gravatar? Maybe something more appropriate — Dame Edna, say…:)
It’s an homage.
Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do. Another little bit of irony to the Thatcher epic.
Quite like when she was in power….
.This is a human being who is suffering. Is this the extent of your compassion?
Yes. Maybe we could ask dr roy to skull fuck her as some kind of honour after she is dead.
Okay, that’s just gross.
It’s sad and very hard to go through for families – my mother-in-law did of Alzheimers. In the end she was actually quite a happy person living in her own world….but for us it was hell. It wore my father-in-law down – he died before she did. We moved in for a year to help my father-in-law out and my husband (both working) took turns staying up at night to watch her. I got so run down I very sick twice.
It hard for families but people like Reagan and Thatcher would have their own nurses and maids, etc. to help out – the family can get their rest.
Red Says…
“JDot — Would I be more relevant if I lived in Toronto? And had a skateboard?”
Nothing….
More worried about the company you keep.
Bottom line. This post is low. You are a smart person and a good writter who can push buttons(You got me). This is just low, so I went low.
PS:To the BT stuff.
I find you waste your time. That’s all you seem to whine about.
Waste of talent in my mind.
That should be “NO”
Feel free to “flame me”…..
You need an edit button Red…
To Ty-guy.
My Man, I have read some of your stuff, but you are the reason my mom said do not to talk to strangers.
I was commenting on the owners blog. So just so you know this is the last time I wan’t to have contact with you.
You are wierd. Maybe I am to, but I don’t wan’t to interact with someone like. Sorry.
Thank-you
All the Best….
What a tragedy.
When I was 28, I had put myself through graduate school and had started a career. Years later, I’m being scolded by an illiterate, 28-year old skateboarder.
How times have changed.
F*ck….
Last time I swear..
Ty says…
“When I was 28, I had put myself through graduate school and had started a career. Years later, I’m being scolded by an illiterate, 28-year old skateboarder.”
Now imagine doing that on a skateboard? Jzzzz, you sound like big Bill O talking about Hip Hop.
thank god I grew up in the spell check generation.
Listen Ty, you have no doubt forgot more then I have learned….
But I could careless My life is great. “Livin’ the dream”(sorry for being young on that spelling lol) But all I can say is your wierd).
That’s all, now please leave me alone.
Thank-you
“Actually people with advanced dementia don’t suffer, but the people around them do.”
If suffering around her indicates dementia, I would imagine her dememtia kicked in around 1979.
And that sodden alcoholic Kennedy has brain cancer. Your point being?
There you go.
RT,
Sad news indeed. Thatcher was a politician that changed a nation and changed perceptions around the world.
She truly was made of iron. All my sympathies to her family and friends.
Thatcher was a politician that changed a nation and changed perceptions around the world.
Absolutely. The perception of an imminent death causing much joy was somewhat unknown before Thatcher came along.
🙂 <— This means I’m funny…like Ann Coulter.
Things I DID NOT admire Lady Thatcher for:
* Her attempts to one-up Her Majesty The Queen;
* The over-liberalisation of the British Economy – she just took it way too far;
* Her recalcitrance on South Africa and Chile;
* Her disdain for The Commonwealth;
* Her contempt for the “Wets” (including HR Macmillan) and their legitimate concerns about her neo-liberal economic programme;
* Her small-minded and quite middle-class snobbishness that looked upon people like Bus-Riders with pity;
Things I DID admire Lady Thatcher for:
* Her firmness in dealing with the IRA and Sinn Fein;
* Her defence of The Falklands colony;
* Her opposition of Communism (while at the same time brokering a firm detente …);
* Her transfer of Public Housing units over to Private Ownership (thereby making tenants owners);
* Her (initial anyway) re-balancing of the economy in reducing the power of the Unions (again, this went too far in the end, and at times was too brutal – but in the end the Union’s death-grip on the British Economy had to be dialed-back).
Overall, it’s a mixed-record with a score somewhat to the positive side of of the ledger. She was influential however, and history will remember her as a rather important figure.
One thing I will not do, is make tasteless remarks about someone in the extreme twilight of their existence.
The rigid, programmatic, and quite unthinking partisanship of people will never cease to amaze (and disgust) me.
Lemmings – all.
One thing I will not do, is make tasteless remarks about someone in the extreme twilight of their existence.
I don’t know; providing a capsule commentary of Thatcher’s record pretty much does that.
🙂 <— This means I can say whatever I want and not be challenged.
Margaret Thatcher was one of Britain’s greatest Prime Ministers
You were in diapers at the time. How would you know?
This gushy over-exuberance is all Conservatives have, isn’t it?
Oh ya well, ted kennedy has cancer, haha?
This is very low of you red tory, very low.
I was 2 weeks old when she was forced out by her party…
How do I know? Well, I’ve read a lot about British history and politics – both left and right – and I came to the conclusion that Britain would have been strangeled by socialism – like France and Itlay – if she did not embark on her economic reforms Yes a lot of people lost jobs which is never a good thing, but those jobs were in the old, outdated nationalized industries in dire need of competion and modernization (they would have been thrown out of work eventually with globalization). But now Britain consistently has the lowest unemployment rates in Europe – where all the other socialist utopias are struggling with high unemployment rates – in good economic times- and bad economic times – how do I know? I read the Economist magazine 😉
Thatcher was on of Britain’s worse Prime Ministers.
As ATY points out, she did bring about the liberalization of many branches of industry. One being financial services. Now she herself ventures into “hedge funds” after her retirement. Some may recall that Tiger Management employed her on the board of directors.
Within months of her joining Tiger, the company lost billions and was forced to close shortly after – blaming an irrational market. Ironic given that the “irrational market” was created in part by Thatcher and the other “swinging dicks”…
Margaret Thatcher was positively Victorian in her attitude with regards to unions. She was a champion of laissez-faire conservatism that seemed on a crusade with all the religious overtones.
She shared many economic theories with Reagan. It’s surprising how many times Capitalism has to be rescued by government…. The U.S., once the biggest creditor nation became the largest debtor nation…
While she was dealing with IRA, she was also praising Abdul Haq (she has him flown to England). Abdul Haq as al Qaida leader who once said “We use poor rockets, we cannot control them. They sometimes miss, I don’t care if I kill 50 civilians”.
I can’t wait for her to expire….
Too bad Teddy Kennedy doesn’t have dementia.He gets to remember the drunken abuse, rape and acts of cowardice performed in his life right until the moment his brain outgrows his skull.
Somewhere a water logged young girl smiles.
🙂 <– look! i can use one too..i’m absolved!
Ah, that’s swell, dear.
Who let Kursk out of rehab?
Ben — Consider it a public service. Doesn’t your sanctimony and moral self-righteousness feel good?
By the way, tighties…gloating over Ted Kennedy’s imminent demise does not absolutely nothing for me. So have at it.
What bizrare ideas they have. Margaret Thatcher is to Canadian Conservatives as Ted Kennedy is to Canadian Liberals?
Huh? Whaa? Eh?
Ti-Guy
August 25, 2008 at 1:55 pm
He probably doesn’t even know of Thatcher’s support for the butcher Pinochet and for apartheid South Africa.
If support for apartheid in South Africa makes you worthy of death then I guess Gandhi got what he deserved?
All of you who would disrespect someone in this condition simply for having different political views is absolutly disgusting.
I think if you read the first comments you’ll see there wasn’t really that much “disrespect” as you put it. That only started when all the phony self-righteousness started to kick in.
What is it with these children and their relentless scolding of perfect strangers?
Go mouth of to your parents like you should, sweeties. After all, your present condition is their fault.
Stay classy RT.
You guys do great work.
From Tuco’s own blog:
DavidA wrote:
Let them have it…I reserve the right to laugh maliciously whenever a Trudeau gets smoked.
08/25/08 18:32:49
tuco wrote:
Fair enough.
08/25/08 19:00:48
Seriously, give it up. No one believes you righties can actually empathise or sympathise, much less with people you don’t even know personally. You’ve spent the last eight years ridiculing, defaming and vilifying everyone who doesn’t agree with you; laughing when Rush Limbaugh called the torture at Abu Ghraib “frat hazing” and chuckling when Ann Coulter accused 9/11 widows of “enjoying their husband’s deaths.”
You have no credibility on this issue. And no amount of self-righteous scolding is going to change that.
austin – “If support for apartheid in South Africa makes you worthy of death then I guess Gandhi got what he deserved?”
Not possible. Gandhi died prior to apartheid existing in Africa. Yes, prior to that non-whites in south africa were subject to several British laws which were racist. Gandhi opposed most, if all, of those laws.
That is not to say that Gandhi was not a racist – he did believe, at least when he was a young man that blacks were inferior to indians. However, there is a huge difference between supporting brutally racist policies in the 1980s and having racist views, while opposing racist policies, over a hundred years ago. Not surprisingly you can’t see the difference.
Furthermore, I have never seen any posts by RedTory et all praising Gandhi – nor do I think that most of us here would consider Gandi anything close to an ideal. He was a social conservative, religious nutter, opponent of science and reason, aweful father, hypocrit etc, etc, etc.
Actually while Gandhi was in South Africa from 1895-1915 a lot of his time was spent on getting Indians on the right side of the “colour bar”. If those action don’t make him a supporter of apratheid what does? So if most of you don’t consider Margret Thatcher or Gandhi ideal political figures, than who is?
austin – “Actually while Gandhi was in South Africa from 1895-1915 a lot of his time was spent on getting Indians on the right side of the “colour bar”. If those action don’t make him a supporter of apratheid what does?”
Gandhi spent much of his time in South Africa not trying to stop indians from losing rights. He also opposed the treatment of blacks and protested against British political acts and regulations against blacks such as The Native Land Act. Martin Luther King Jr concentrated on the oppression of blacks – that doesn’t mean that he was racist and supported oppression against hispanics.
“So if most of you don’t consider Margret Thatcher or Gandhi ideal political figures, than who is?”
Really? I have to consider either Thatcher or Gandhi the ideal? I reject both and would prefer to have neither as a leader of my country (although at least Gandhi had a tendency to recognize some of his flaws and had little interest in being the leader of his country). Both were uncompromising, had no doubt that they were right, and had almost no interest in what the other side had to say.
The other thing to mention is that is very possible that other oppressed populations in south africa didn’t actually want Gandhi’s help. Most of Gandhi’s early work against the British in south africa was a spectacular failure. Until shortly before Gandhi left SA he was considered to have done more damage than good for the indians living in SA, indeed, most indians there were not huge fans of his to say the least. Even as he was leaving he received most of his praise for standing up to the british, and for using non-violent resistance, but not for results, because he really didn’t actually intiate much, if any, positive change there.
Interesting…. Why is first comment awaiting moderation?
It is interesting to see all of the experts on Imperial South African History emerge …
sarcasm intended.
“It is interesting to see all of the experts on Imperial South African History emerge …
sarcasm intended.”
I don’t claim to be an expert on SA, or anything else for that matter. I have however, read through almost all of Gandhi’s 100 volume “collected writings” (along with several biographies which generally give a far more biased and less critical view of Gandhi than he did himself) in which he is very candid about his failures in SA and how after each of his campaigns completely fell apart there it took him years each time to regain the respect and position within the indian community to be able to launch another one. He wrote about almost every major political policy while he was there. As for apartheid not existing until after Gandhi’s death that doesn’t take an expert – any history book will tell you apartheid started in south africa after the election of the National Party in 1948.